Round 163

Round
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Billy James Brightraven
Billy James Brightraven Here's my challenge,

“Lingua mendax et dolosa,
lingua procax, venenosa,
lingua digna detruncari,
et in igne concremari,
que me dicit deceptorem,
et non fidum amatorem,
quam amabam, dimisisse
et ad alteram transisse!”
Nicolás Straccia
Nicolás Straccia Is that plain latin? (not that that makes it easy or anything)
Anna Robbins
Anna Robbins Looks like it to me, too. In which case, I understand most of the first half and all of the second half, so I probably shouldn't participate. :P
Billy James Brightraven
Billy James Brightraven I thought it might have been a bit long, but I figured the large amount of repetition cuts down on the challenge :p

Yup, it's Latin*.
Christian James Meredith
Christian James Meredith Luckily I still don't understand a lot of this because of the vocab (non-scientific) he chose :P

But I'm skipping over the bits I know well

delosa = sweet?
digna = whatever the adjective root of dignity is, dignified?
fidum = I forgot the right term, but something like trust or belief
Christian James Meredith
Christian James Meredith Since we haven't had a CJV translation for a while:

I'm assuming "Mendax" is a Mongolian version of panadol (mend = health(y) or something like that)

Procax is their competitor

Detruncari sounds like we've moved into viagra territory

concremari sounds like the viagra's solved the problem

deceptorem sounds like viagra hasn't solved all their marital issues though, and et non fidum amatorem just confirms that

And now he's sleeping on the couch near the transistors.
Arief Wibowo
Arief Wibowo I like how Billy James Brightraven put an asterisk after "Yup, it's Latin".....
*) Terms and conditions apply :P

I will be traveling around the city today, but will check in from time to time.
Billy James Brightraven
Billy James Brightraven Crap, misspelt a word. Fixing!

delosa, dplosa = dolosa
Billy James Brightraven
Billy James Brightraven You mention trust, belief; I suggest thinking of a word that begins with f and ends with a coronal consonant…
Marius Vincenzii Dennischter
Marius Vincenzii Dennischter Adeste fideles = Oh come, all ye faithful...
Christian James Meredith
Christian James Meredith Billy James Brightraven Eh? Ends with a coronal consonant? I don't know a word like that! Closest I can get is faif! :D
Marius Vincenzii Dennischter
Marius Vincenzii Dennischter lingua mendax et dolosa = bullshitting tongue and pain
lingua procax, venenosa, = immoral tongue, venomous
lingua digna detruncari, = dignity tongue (detruncari)
et in igne concremari, = and in ignition concrement
que me dicit deceptorem, = that I told deception
et non fidum amatorem, = and not loving faith
quam amabam, dimisisse = how lovely, dismissing
et ad alteram transisse = e ad altro transizione
Billy James Brightraven
Billy James Brightraven Re: Vincensiu :P

I would maybe not have used the term 'bullshitting', but yes, that's the gist of it.
Not reaally immoral but close.
third line has the wrong part of speech for digna,
fourth has mistranslated 'igne concremari'
fifth is confused on who does whom,
sixth sees a verb where there is none,
seventh lost track of one and bent another,
And eight follows seven.
Marius Vincenzii Dennischter
Marius Vincenzii Dennischter mmmm thanks, but I really gotta go back to sleep again...
will mend my translation later...
Forced myself to wake up coz I had to go to centrelink, but had a stop in medicare and I decided that I should avoid cenno, lol
Oh right, Christian, we do have centrelink as well in Wales :D
Arief Wibowo
Arief Wibowo A ha, so Mendax is Mongolian constipation medicine, Christian James Meredith! :D
Sarah Karoline
Sarah Karoline I've been trying to figure out kahjuta from the Estonian text, and now I see Billy has been victorious. I hadn't given up, Vincensiu It seems like a lifetime since I last won..., but it's been enough time to come up with a nice text, were I to win again... :)

I'll try to figure out some Latin, although it's seems 3/4 complete!

Billy
Marco Airaghi
Marco Airaghi good
Marco Airaghi
Marco Airaghi isteal it
Sarah Karoline
Sarah Karoline Are you going to steal the text, Marco? :)
Sarah Karoline
Sarah Karoline Here's my version:
lingua mendax et dolosa. Deceitful tongue and pained/cunning
lingua procax, venenosa. Wanton tongue, venomous
lingua digna detruncari, dignified tongue, mutilated
et in igne concremari, and by fire consumed
que me dicit deceptorem,
[that a betrayer told me / That I was told about a betrayer?]
et non fidum amatorem, [and lover is not faithful]
quam amabam, dimisisse how I was loved, sent away
et ad alteram transisse. and passed over to another.
---
Multiple Edits as always :)
Sarah Karoline
Sarah Karoline One believes it needs some to many adjustments/changes... :)
Arief Wibowo
Arief Wibowo Two believes I want to have Wantons for dinner (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wonton)... :D

I am still outside though, haven't been able to stjälcuri
Sarah Karoline
Sarah Karoline I had some of those at the weekend, Arief!
Sarah Karoline
Sarah Karoline Aaaargh, I can't improve this translation. It looks rather wrong.. Who can stjälcuri it?!
Marco Airaghi
Marco Airaghi i steal the ntire image
Marius Vincenzii Dennischter
Marius Vincenzii Dennischter Sorry was extremely busy today. Will try again later :(
Billy James Brightraven
Billy James Brightraven It is rather wrong Sarah :/ I suggest reading up a bit on Latin verbs :p
Sarah Karoline
Sarah Karoline I knew it wasn't victorious :) I used wiktionary for most of it. Hm.... My bad luck continues :) :) :)
Billy James Brightraven
Billy James Brightraven Let me recommend this http://www.perseus.tufts.edu/hopper/morph?l=dies&la=la
Sarah Karoline
Sarah Karoline Thank you for the link! I've just found a 1956 verb conjugator too. ----
Dicit = He/She/It says. (3.sg. present)
Dimisisse = I loved (1st sg. imperfect)
Transisse = ... (perfect infinitive active)
---
Ego will try again nella mattina, unless it's stjälcuried overnight!
Sarah Karoline
Sarah Karoline Still working at it...
Marius Vincenzii Dennischter
Marius Vincenzii Dennischter VERSION 2:

lingua mendax et dolosa = lying tongue and deceitful
lingua procax, venenosa, = "immoral" tongue, venomous
lingua digna detruncari, = mutilating dignified tongue
et in igne concremari, = and burned up in ignition
que me dicit deceptorem, = that he told me a deceiver
et non fidum amatorem, = and not faithful lover
quam amabam, dimisisse = how I have loved, dismissing
et ad alteram transisse = and to change the other to transiting
Дайте Нефть Из Баку
Дайте Нефть Из Баку Vincensiu, I was in Sweden until this morning and chances are I'll be quite busy until 21 december. Hopefully I'll have more time during Christmas holidays.
Matteo Cheri
Matteo Cheri Hi guys, I was away for study problems :/, what have I lost?
Sarah Karoline
Sarah Karoline Matteo We're on Latin now... [Billy's round] Here's the text:
Lingua mendax et dolosa,
lingua procax, venenosa,
lingua digna detruncari,
et in igne concremari,
que me dicit deceptorem,
et non fidum amatorem,
quam amabam, dimisisse
et ad alteram transisse!”
Matteo Cheri
Matteo Cheri Sarah I'll stay out of this, I practically understood the 90% of it
Sarah Karoline
Sarah Karoline I wish I did, Matteo!
Marius Vincenzii Dennischter
Marius Vincenzii Dennischter Im too exhausted to continue. Just got home from work. Had a terrible shift. Going to bed immediately.
Matteo Cheri
Matteo Cheri Sarah, well... I'm native in 2 neolatin languages, I know a third and I'm learning another 2. It's normal that I can get the most of it ;)
Sarah Karoline
Sarah Karoline I'm still working on it too, Vincensiu I'm not sure if we've got anything right or wrong though...
Matteo I've studied a little Latin and a little to a lot of some modern Romance languages. I'm getting nowhere, it would seem.
Arief Wibowo
Arief Wibowo Version 3 (stjälcuri from Vincensiu Dionisiu's Version 2 above):
Tongue* is mendacious/lying and deceitful,
tongue* is "immoral", venomous,
tongue* is mutilating dignity,
and burned up in fire,
that he told me a deceiver,
and not faithful lover,
how I have loved, dismissing,
and to change the other to transiting!

* or "language"
Sarah Karoline
Sarah Karoline A little update, or not: I haven't made any changes to my translation since 9th December. Have we got the first four lines wrong too, Billy ?
Here's my 2nd version again.
lingua mendax et dolosa. Deceitful tongue and pained/cunning
lingua procax, venenosa. Wanton tongue, venomous
lingua digna detruncari, dignified tongue, mutilated
et in igne concremari, and by fire consumed

que me dicit deceptorem, [that a betrayer told me /That I was told about a betrayer?]
et non fidum amatorem, [and lover is not faithful]
quam amabam, dimisisse how I was loved, sent away
et ad alteram transisse. and passed over to another.
Billy James Brightraven
Billy James Brightraven Hint : detruncari is an infinitive
Arief Wibowo
Arief Wibowo Tongue* is mendacious/lying and deceitful,
tongue* is "immoral", venomous,
tongue* is to mutilate dignity,
and burned up in fire,
that he told me a deceiver,
and not faithful lover,
how I have loved, dismissing,
and to change the other to transiting!

* or "language"
Billy James Brightraven
Billy James Brightraven Hint: What does dignus actually mean in Latin? You were all thinking of dignified which means made dign-...
Arief Wibowo
Arief Wibowo dīgnus m (feminine dīgna, neuter dīgnum); first/second declension
appropriate, fitting, worthy, meet

Hmm... "Tongue is inappropriate" perhaps?
Billy James Brightraven
Billy James Brightraven There is no negation. Look at the verb next to it to get the idea.
Arief Wibowo
Arief Wibowo Tongue is to mutilate worthy?
Tongue is to mutilate worthiness?
Hmmm....
Billy James Brightraven
Billy James Brightraven It can't be worthiness at least, digna is an adjective here.
Arief Wibowo
Arief Wibowo A sentence with subject, verb, and adjective... How do I form that...? :D

Appropriate/fitting tongue mutilates?

But in this case my version of the first 2 sentences are wrong
Billy James Brightraven
Billy James Brightraven Perhaps investigating the kind of infinitive detruncari is will prove fruitful.
Sarah Karoline
Sarah Karoline Version 3. I scoured some Latin textbooks, and I've come up with the following.

1. Detruncari = present infinitive passive = to be lopped/cut off/truncated
2. Dinga = feminine, singular, nominative = worthy/deserving, ...
[lingua digna detruncari = Deserving tongue is truncated]
3.Concremari = present infinitive passive = to be consumed/to be burned
[Et in igne concremari = And it is consumed by fire]
Sarah Karoline
Sarah Karoline Dicit = 3rd person singular active = told
[Que me dicit deceptorem et non fidum amatorem = That a deceiver and non faithful lover tells me]
quam amabam, dimisisse
[(oh), how I loved, I was sent away]
et ad alteram transisse.
[and I was passed over to another.]
Arief Wibowo
Arief Wibowo Brace brace brace, we are experiencing a catastrophic slow down...
Sarah Karoline
Sarah Karoline Latin is taxing in a nice way! I imagine the Latin speakers are bored waiting for us to finish this easy text... :)
Arief Wibowo
Arief Wibowo I havent been able to make any progress :(
Billy James Brightraven
Billy James Brightraven Aww.

Okay, Sarah, you're onto something!

Remember, the verbs are infinitive and passive… the English equivalent would be "to be X' no?

Tongue worthy to be… ;)

Then, you ought to match case in the "que me dicit decept…" line.

Accusative goes with accusative. :P

I can't believe this is taking longer than my Italic round using a dead, obscure language. xD
Marius Vincenzii Dennischter
Marius Vincenzii Dennischter VERSION 3:

lingua mendax et dolosa = lying & deceitful tongue
lingua procax, venenosa,
lingua digna detruncari, = wanton, venomous and dignity mutilating tongue
et in igne concremari, = and burned up in ignition
que me dicit deceptorem,
et non fidum amatorem, = That a deceiver and an unfaithful lover told me
quam amabam, dimisisse = how I was loved, and sent away
et ad alteram transisse = and passed to others
Billy James Brightraven
Billy James Brightraven Vincensiu, stjälcuri a bit of Sarah's work :p on the infinitives. It's not "mutilating" or "burned up".
Sarah Karoline
Sarah Karoline "Hopp, det finns hopp" :) Well, a little...
Sarah Karoline
Sarah Karoline Version 4 or so:
Deceitful and cunning tongue, wanton and venomous tongue, dignified tongue to be cut off and consumed by fire.
That a betrayer and unfaithful lover told me how I was loved and sent away and passed over for another.
+++++
lingua mendax et dolosa, lingua procax, venenosa, lingua digna detruncari et in igne concremari.
que me dicit deceptorem et non fidum amatorem. quam amabam, dimisisse et ad alteram transisse.
----
This makes classic Norwegian literature seem rather chirpy :)
5 stars to Billy for remaining enthusiastic and hopeful whilst we slave away and I mess up Latin!
Billy James Brightraven
Billy James Brightraven hint: 'me' IS the' deceptorem et non fidum amatorem'!

accusative with accusative :D
Sarah Karoline
Sarah Karoline I meant to add to last night's post that I couldn't figure out how to make a sentence with two accusatives... Now, after a long trek in the countryside, where I contemplated Latin and salvaged some more "hopp", I came up with the following: "me the betrayer and unfaithful lover said how I was loved and sent away and passed over to another".
---
Do I need to contemplate this again in another field tomorrow, Billy?
Marius Vincenzii Dennischter
Marius Vincenzii Dennischter I'm kinda facing dead end. Mikkel any fresh idea from your side?
Mikkel Ramzuiv Pittmann Wilson
Mikkel Ramzuiv Pittmann Wilson "Oh, that traitorous and unfaithful lover. The said how much they loved me, then sent away and passed over for another"
Billy James Brightraven
Billy James Brightraven Que me dicit = that calls me...
Sarah Karoline
Sarah Karoline Version 510!
Deceitful and cunning tongue, wanton and venomous tongue, dignified tongue to be cut off and consumed by fire that calls me a betrayer and unfaithful lover. (Oh), how I was loved and sent away and passed over for another"
Billy James Brightraven
Billy James Brightraven Hmm, you guys are really having trouble with the voice aspect of Latin verbs. amabam is active, i.e "I loved" not "was loved" :P

So, the first part is down pretty good, except you keep trying to translate digna as dignified instead of worthy. :P

Quam is not "how" in this case but the feminine relative pronoun :)

This is taking so long :( I don't think I'll host any more Classical language rounds anymore.

Also, calling Victor, help 'em!
Victor Wåhlstrand Skärström
Victor Wåhlstrand Skärström You called! ^^

What is the round? Latinate, something. :P
Sarah Karoline
Sarah Karoline Sorry to be sloooow, Billy et al who could have figured this out in minutes! We might do better next time! :) Although I'm not finding it easy (I don't know why), I still like classical texts, so no need to avoid them like the plague!:)
____
Billy James Brightraven
Billy James Brightraven Haha, no, just worried that I might've broken the game. xD
Victor Wåhlstrand Skärström
Victor Wåhlstrand Skärström Quat is the round? :O
Sarah Karoline
Sarah Karoline Not for me, Billy :)
Victor : hérna er spilið - >"lingua mendax et dolosa, lingua procax, venenosa, lingua digna detruncari et in igne concremari. que me dicit deceptorem et non fidum amatorem. quam amabam, dimisisse et ad alteram transisse."
Arief Wibowo
Arief Wibowo Sorry, I'm busy between writing documentation, prepping for (real/practical) driving test, and kayaking... Don't worry, I haven't abandoned the game, I shall be back after next Tuesday :)

The round o Billy James Brightraven:
Lingua mendax et dolosa,
lingua procax, venenosa,
lingua digna detruncari,
et in igne concremari,
que me dicit deceptorem,
et non fidum amatorem,
quam amabam, dimisisse
et ad alteram transisse!
Sarah Karoline
Sarah Karoline Good luck with the kayaking and driving test - hopefully not simultaneously, Arief
Arief Wibowo
Arief Wibowo Fortunately no... The car engine pistons will do the kayaking for me :D
I had a fun time at a water theme park today (→ 3++ hours of newbie kayaking)
Victor Wåhlstrand Skärström
Victor Wåhlstrand Skärström It looks fairly good. I think you need to mind the relative pronoun "quam", and that "amabo" is not the passive form.

How come "dimissise" is passive in your translation, but "transisse" is not?
Sarah Karoline
Sarah Karoline Hm...perché sono confusata! "wails" :) Ancora:
quam - who. amabam - I loved. dimisisse - has dismissed. transisse - has passed over
Victor Wåhlstrand Skärström
Victor Wåhlstrand Skärström Indeed, but: "how I was loved and sent away". :P
Victor Wåhlstrand Skärström
Victor Wåhlstrand Skärström It is ambiguous, and the translation isn't. :p
Sarah Karoline
Sarah Karoline Can I make it ambiguous! :)
On a serious note, "was" was implied in my second sentence, but I omitted it for stylistic purposes, e.g. "how I was loved and (I was) sent away." - > "How I was loved and sent away"
Wikipedia says "transisse" and "dimisisse" are active and not passive, but another site said they were passive. Argh!
Victor Wåhlstrand Skärström
Victor Wåhlstrand Skärström Okay, the >correct< translation needn't be ambiguous. ^^
Sarah Karoline
Sarah Karoline Version 6:
Deceitful and cunning tongue, wanton and venomous tongue, worthy tongue to be cut off and consumed by fire that calls me a betrayer and unfaithful lover.
(He/She) who I loved, has gone away and gone over to another"
---
If Wikipedia and Teach Yourself Latin are correct, "transisse" and "dimisisse" are active perfect infinitives.... If I hear screams from way up north, I'll assume I've misunderstood!
Sarah Karoline
Sarah Karoline Or do we have another case of NSIH?:
Nordmän Skjuter Inkompetenta Sprogspelare
or
Northmen Sue Incompetent Sprogspelare!
Marius Vincenzii Dennischter
Marius Vincenzii Dennischter From the link that Billy sent few days ago (Latin Word Study Tool) it shows dimisisse and transisse as verb active perfect infinitive.
So I think you are correct, and my newer version is very similar to yours.
And if I hear screams from way up north, I assume that it's from you and I shall go back and make some more twist to the translation amendment :)
Sarah Karoline
Sarah Karoline Aaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaarrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrgggggggggggggghhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! :) :) :)
"Down With The Aspect"! :)
Was your latest version on the 13th, Vincensiu
Marius Vincenzii Dennischter
Marius Vincenzii Dennischter VERSION 3, according to sprogspelet website record: Fri, 2013-12-13 15:49:12

Arief, are you still in Koala-land? Where on Earth did you do the kayaking?
Sarah Karoline
Sarah Karoline Found it!
Billy James Brightraven
Billy James Brightraven Dismissed, not gone away. :P
Victor Wåhlstrand Skärström
Victor Wåhlstrand Skärström How could "dimisisse" possibly mean "dismissed"?! Preposterous!
Marius Vincenzii Dennischter
Marius Vincenzii Dennischter ...who I loved, has sent away and passed over to another?
Sarah Karoline
Sarah Karoline I had dismissed originally, but thought "sent away" sounded better. "Dismissed" sounds like something a headmistress or employer might do. I'll bring it back into version 7! :):)
Billy James Brightraven
Billy James Brightraven Mweh, I was more focused on on dimitto's general sense of dismissal and offsending. :P

And it's perfect so the tense isn't too far off.
Billy James Brightraven
Billy James Brightraven Sent away works, I was just seeing "gone away" which is much awry :P
Victor Wåhlstrand Skärström
Victor Wåhlstrand Skärström Gone off...!
Billy James Brightraven
Billy James Brightraven Great try Vincensiu, now I'd suggest focusing on whom was doing the dismissing. :D
Sarah Karoline
Sarah Karoline Version I've lost count:
Deceitful and cunning tongue, wanton and venomous tongue, worthy tongue to be cut off and consumed by fire that calls me a betrayer and unfaithful lover.
(He/She) who I loved, has sent away and gone off with another"
Marius Vincenzii Dennischter
Marius Vincenzii Dennischter (dia) who I loved, I have sent away and passed over on another?
Billy James Brightraven
Billy James Brightraven Yup, I (y) of your sentences.

She whom I loved, I have sent away and that I have passed on to another.

Now, there's one tiny piece missing and it has to do with how this sentence ties together with the previous ones. A hint: dicit is yet relevant! It's why the verbs are in the infinitive and not conjugated for person.
Billy James Brightraven
Billy James Brightraven Have a song version of it (with obligatory hilarious German Latin pronunciation!)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xjqTa5sAf9I

Now, the comments seem safe, translationwise, but be careful, eh.
Sarah Karoline
Sarah Karoline Ah-ha, Qnt♥l!
Sarah Karoline
Sarah Karoline I'm thinking...
Sarah Karoline
Sarah Karoline My thought processes have flatlined....
Victor Wåhlstrand Skärström
Victor Wåhlstrand Skärström My attempt, to settle this:

Deceitful and cunning tongue,
Wanton and venomous tongue,
Worthy tongue to be cut off,
And consumed by fire,
That calls me a betrayer,
And an unfaithful lover.
That she whom I have loved,
I have sent away, and that I have passed on to another.
Billy James Brightraven
Billy James Brightraven Excellent! Victor succeeds!

Wooo! Nikator!
Sarah Karoline
Sarah Karoline Oh dear, it was just one word that Vincensiu and I were missing. :)
Victor
Billy James Brightraven
Billy James Brightraven Yup, the word that ties the sentences together xD :P
Sarah Karoline
Sarah Karoline I spent about an hour last night looking at "dicit" and "tramissise" . [Insert red-faced emoticon here]
Sarah Karoline
Sarah Karoline Billy: you must be stressed!
A new card for leaders with difficult rounds - >
Marius Vincenzii Dennischter
Marius Vincenzii Dennischter Congratulations Victor!!
Sarah Karoline
Sarah Karoline [For some reason I can't find the "referee" section on the sprogspelet website, so I can't tag Our Viktator as the winner. In the meantime I guess we should swot up on Swedish engineering manuals... hint :) ]
Marius Vincenzii Dennischter
Marius Vincenzii Dennischter Hmmm... The referee button suppose to be in the live page under the sticky notes page.
I'm at work. Can't do much unfortunately. Will sort that once Im home.
New round prof emeritus @Victor ???
Sarah Karoline
Sarah Karoline I still can't see it either, Vincensiu. I wonder what the new round will be...!
Arief, have you removed the referee link?
Victor Wåhlstrand Skärström
Victor Wåhlstrand Skärström Yeah, I shall prepare something...! Hmm... Gothic, Greek, or Swedish...
Sarah Karoline
Sarah Karoline A hybrid? :) Gothic Swedish in Greek script...
Victor Wåhlstrand Skärström
Victor Wåhlstrand Skärström New one coming up...!
Marius Vincenzii Dennischter
Marius Vincenzii Dennischter Sarah Karoline I tagged Victor in our sprogspelet page. The referee console is actually above the sticky notes. Just below the last comment.
Round
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