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Brad Wilson This is an excerpt from a chapter titled: Pi̲chukka
Chukka itabana, aboha achʋffa illa yo̲. Sʋshki micha A̲ki yʋt wihʋt chukkoa tok. Himmako, ahoponi aboha micha anusit aiasha aboha yo achakʋli yohmi tok. Yohmi ho̲ Pokni ʋt wihʋt ibachukkoa tok. Aboha tuklo mʋt achaka ma̲, chukka itabana aboha mʋto Pokni imaboha toba tok. Chukka aboha tuchina a̲sha yʋmmako̲ si-aiʋlhpoa tok.
Chukka itabana, aboha achʋffa illa yo̲. Sʋshki micha A̲ki yʋt wihʋt chukkoa tok. Himmako, ahoponi aboha micha anusit aiasha aboha yo achakʋli yohmi tok. Yohmi ho̲ Pokni ʋt wihʋt ibachukkoa tok. Aboha tuklo mʋt achaka ma̲, chukka itabana aboha mʋto Pokni imaboha toba tok. Chukka aboha tuchina a̲sha yʋmmako̲ si-aiʋlhpoa tok.
Brad Wilson Sorry about the sloppy-looking characters i̲ and such. I couldn't find letters with built-in underscore in my font set.
Arief Wibowo Wait, we'd need Brad Wilson to edit this comment: http://on.fb.me/1nvMl2j with full translation to be tagged on our website 
Brad Wilson Ohh, I deleted it. Let's see...
I wanted your hand
you didn't want to give it
While I talked, you didn't
want to listen. When I cried
you laughed and kept on saying
it isn't so.
Today I had lemons
I made lemonade
I think
of the white sheep grazing in the field.
When my heart cried
I stayed in bed
when I was happy
I would sing
I wanted your hand
you didn't want to give it
While I talked, you didn't
want to listen. When I cried
you laughed and kept on saying
it isn't so.
Today I had lemons
I made lemonade
I think
of the white sheep grazing in the field.
When my heart cried
I stayed in bed
when I was happy
I would sing
Arief Wibowo Oh no oh no, Brad Wilson, sorry, you have to edit one of your previous comments (the timestamp has to come before your new thread), sorry for asking a bit too much 
Brad Wilson yes, the underlining is one convention for nasalisation, the other convention is the superscript n
Adrian Baxt-Dent Are Pichukka, Chukka and chukkoa different forms of the same word? verb, noun, adjective or some such?
Arief Wibowo We later find out that the chapter is actually titled Pikkachu and this is pokemon language 
Adrian Baxt-Dent That was my first thought Arief Wibowo, but I was to mature to say it. (Yeah, that's me, mature.... HA!!!)
Arief Wibowo Naaah pokemon is for all ages. Hahahaha
Interestingly a quick search reveals Hindi resources, but the text doesn't feel Hindi at all... Hurm...
Interestingly a quick search reveals Hindi resources, but the text doesn't feel Hindi at all... Hurm...
Wrik Chatterjee Hey, you stole my new thread introduction, Brad Wilson! Anyways, Quechua? Aymara? Tehuelche? Mapudugun? Something Cariban? I hope it is the latter; I love the Cariban languages so much! They're so weird!
Wrik Chatterjee Somehow I have a feeling this might be Algic, in which case this is the second time our beloved SpSp has seen an Algic language.
Brad Wilson Wrik, I liked it ... so I borrowed it. And no to all your choices. One of my languages is Papiamento, of which Arawak is a component. But not in this challenge.
And no to all your choices. One of my languages is Papiamento, of which Arawak is a component. But not in this challenge. Brad Wilson This is NOT from Central or South America; neither is it from Canada. It is spoken within the US.
Wrik Chatterjee Is it one of the Chumashan languages? I remember reading on their Wikipedia page that the family has six members.
Wrik Chatterjee Even then, the word wihʋt reminded me too much of the name Wiyot, and I somehow doubt that the Wiyot and any of the Chumashan-speaking communities were ever in contact.
Brad Wilson according to wiki, there are about 16,000 native speakers of the 6 languages in this family ... and this one is the largest with about 10,500 (according to 2010 census)
Brad Wilson give that man a cigar !!! now, how can I give you guys a dictionary - there's not much online - I have a pdf
Wrik Chatterjee And the same text in PDF form: http://www.jstor.org/stable/pdfplus/981486.pdf?acceptTC=true&jpdConfirm=true
Brad Wilson yes, google books has several - don't know if you can download them or not. I got mine thru archive.org. https://archive.org/details/choctawlanguag00byinrich
Wrik Chatterjee Hard to believe that such a widely spoken language only has grammars dating from the 1850s :/ .
Brad Wilson Yes, there are very few modern books. But then, these 1800s-era books are so good, perhaps noone thought they could be improved upon. The Germans never cracked the Choctaw code-talkers in World War I or II.
Brad Wilson The good thing is that word forms are pretty stable, so if you can find it in the dictionary, you'll probably have a good idea of the meaning. The bad thing is that Choctaw meanings are rather nebulous and can encompass a wide range of ideas with a single word.
Wrik Chatterjee So it isn't intensely synthetic like the Algonquian languages can be? That might make this less mean than my Myaamia round, but it *is* a whole paragraph.
Brad Wilson And this challenge does not have very much in the way of agglutinating (is that even a word?)
Brad Wilson It's rather late here, so I will bid your leave to ponder this. I probably won't be back on until tomorrow evening (since work doesn't let me use fb).
Wrik Chatterjee Crudely glossing-Pi̲chukka: Loghouse, other room mere(ly) [yo̲]. [Sʋshki] and, besides [A̲ki yʋt wihʋt] had been brought in. [Himmako], kithen and [anusit] stay(ed) (in) the other room [achakʋli] so much earlier. So [ho̲] Mother(?) [ʋt wihʋt] had been brought in with (earlier). Two rooms were a continuation [mʋt ma̲], loghouse room [mʋto] Mother(?) temple [tuba tok] Three log rooms [a̲sha yʋmmako̲ si-ahiolh] beast earlier.
Wrik Chatterjee Conclusions: there's something about a loghouse. It has at least three rooms, one of which presumably is a kitchen, and a person, presumably female, is staying inside. Somehow there's a big animal involved too.
Marius Vincenzii Dennischter "bookmarking" the thread.
Oh also, congratulations to Brad for your first victory in Sps
Oh also, congratulations to Brad for your first victory in Sps
Brad Wilson Wrik, very good. You have successfully glossed many of the "concepts", although your actual words in some cases are somewhat far from the mark. Oh, there is no beast involved in this challenge ... except perhaps the challenge itself.
Brad Wilson marking Wrik's gloss ... [Pi̲chukka]: Loghouse, {other} room mere(ly) [yo̲]. [Sʋshki] and, {besides} [A̲ki yʋt wihʋt] had been /brought/ in. [Himmako], kithen and [anusit] {stay(ed) (in)} {the other} room [achakʋli] {so much earlier}. So [ho̲] /Mother(?)/ [ʋt wihʋt] had been /brought/ in with (earlier). Two rooms {were a continuation} [mʋt ma̲], loghouse room [mʋto] /Mother(?)/ {temple} [tuba tok] /Three log rooms/ [a̲sha yʋmmako̲ si-ahiolh] {beast} {earlier}. ... {}wrong //concept good
Marius Vincenzii Dennischter Won't be able to participate for now.... I'm knackered. Was very busy @ work that I can barely walk. Gotta go to bed str8 away, Maybe I'll give it ago when I wake up.
Wrik Chatterjee Andy Justyna Vincensiu Arief Zev Thatcher Sarah Christian Billy Adrian Dago Nicolás Maleen Ed Mikkel Helene Maria Дайте Edmund Murilo and anybody else I forgot
Brad Wilson I'll give you a couple of hints ... Sʋshki, A̲ki, Pokni are names, but you'll find them in the dictionary (with a prefix). The vowels ʋ is written ạ in the online dictionary. The nasal vowels (underlined) are also written aⁿ, iⁿ, etc.
Mikkel Ramzuiv Pittmann Wilson I'm still busy with exams - Though summer will soon be upon us; Maybe then, but maybe not
Brad Wilson I guess people aren't interested in Amerindian languages. It's not too hard ... most of the words are in the dictionary with little modification.
Marius Vincenzii Dennischter anusit = bedroom, or something to do with bed
achakuli = spliced
The dictionary provided above was a good resources, but the PDF file was just too big that it takes ages to open it
Sadly my laptop crashes after I found the 2 words above
achakuli = spliced
The dictionary provided above was a good resources, but the PDF file was just too big that it takes ages to open it
Sadly my laptop crashes after I found the 2 words above
Brad Wilson Yes, anusit=bedroom, achakʋli=join together. Unfortunately, there is no online Choctaw dictionary - the pdf is all I can offer.
Marius Vincenzii Dennischter If we can handle isolated Nanchowry, consonantless Sardu, ambiguously cryptic Japanese, & stalling Swedish, we should be able to solve this round!! With sufficient amount of information and a good dictionary, this round shouldn't be impossible!!
Anna Haven't seen you for ages?
Andy We miss you here!
Victor Have you forsaken us?
Anna Haven't seen you for ages?
Andy We miss you here!
Victor Have you forsaken us?
Brad Wilson Here is a link to some online lessons (but no great dictionary) http://www.choctawschool.com/
Brad Wilson Here is another link to the Choctaw Nation - not a lot of language resources, unfortunately. http://www.choctawnation.com/culture-heritage/choctaw-language/
Andy Ayres Thanks, Vincensiu! I didn't think I'd be too missed, glad to know otherwise. I've been snowed under with work, but I'll see if I can make some progress in the little free time I have tomorrow
Brad Wilson The eventual English translation is by the author, so we can be sure that it is a true meaning of her thoughts. I have prepared my gloss for this thread; but ultimately, her translation is the goal.
Marius Vincenzii Dennischter Andy This is what you should do to your students:
especially at 0:53
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=V4uXueOysG8&index=25&list=UUfR8ONN-amN4h81rtQAx6Mw
especially at 0:53
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=V4uXueOysG8&index=25&list=UUfR8ONN-amN4h81rtQAx6Mw
Victor Wåhlstrand Skärström You know, I've been terribly busy with my graduation this thursday, but as soon as it's all over, I'll get back to you!
Ed Blankenship Ok... So my graduation was last week and I finished moving (until the end of the month when I move again) so give me a few minutes to set up and I'll hop in here and see if I can contribute...
Anna Robbins Sorry, I've been a bit busy as well! I had final exams a couple weeks ago, and I'm in the process of organising my belongings to move continents 
I'll be studying in Sweden next year, so I've been dealing with all the preparations. I also have courses during summer, but I'll pop in every so often!
I'll be studying in Sweden next year, so I've been dealing with all the preparations. I also have courses during summer, but I'll pop in every so often!
Marius Vincenzii Dennischter So we are officially ställed again, aren't we?
Ok, once I got home from work, I'll list all the vocabs that I can find in the dictionary that Brad provided. Then hopefully one of you will b kind enough to arrange them and construct a good sentence. Unless someone solve this round before I got home :p
Ok, once I got home from work, I'll list all the vocabs that I can find in the dictionary that Brad provided. Then hopefully one of you will b kind enough to arrange them and construct a good sentence. Unless someone solve this round before I got home :p
Brad Wilson Here's the text again, line by line:
Pi̲chukka (chapter title)
Chukka itabana, aboha achʋffa illa yo̲.
Sʋshki micha A̲ki yʋt wihʋt chukkoa tok.
Himmako, ahoponi aboha micha anusit aiasha aboha yo achakʋli yohmi tok.
Yohmi ho̲ Pokni ʋt wihʋt ibachukkoa tok.
Aboha tuklo mʋt achaka ma̲, chukka itabana aboha mʋto Pokni imaboha toba tok.
Chukka aboha tuchina a̲sha yʋmmako̲ si-aiʋlhpoa tok.
Pi̲chukka (chapter title)
Chukka itabana, aboha achʋffa illa yo̲.
Sʋshki micha A̲ki yʋt wihʋt chukkoa tok.
Himmako, ahoponi aboha micha anusit aiasha aboha yo achakʋli yohmi tok.
Yohmi ho̲ Pokni ʋt wihʋt ibachukkoa tok.
Aboha tuklo mʋt achaka ma̲, chukka itabana aboha mʋto Pokni imaboha toba tok.
Chukka aboha tuchina a̲sha yʋmmako̲ si-aiʋlhpoa tok.
Brad Wilson Here are the glosses so far:
chukka itabana = loghouse
aboha = room
chukkoa tok = had been /brought/ in {similar concept}
ahoponi aboha = kithen
micha = and
anusit = bedroom, or something to do with bed
achakʋli = spliced / join together
yohmi = so {I can live with that}
Pokni = /Mother(?)/ {almost}
ibachukkoa tok = had been /brought/ in with (earlier) {similar concept}
aboha tuklo = two rooms
tuchina = three
chukka itabana = loghouse
aboha = room
chukkoa tok = had been /brought/ in {similar concept}
ahoponi aboha = kithen
micha = and
anusit = bedroom, or something to do with bed
achakʋli = spliced / join together
yohmi = so {I can live with that}
Pokni = /Mother(?)/ {almost}
ibachukkoa tok = had been /brought/ in with (earlier) {similar concept}
aboha tuklo = two rooms
tuchina = three
Brad Wilson This has nothing to do directly with the challenge, but thought you'd like to hear some spoken Choctaw. http://youtu.be/uL-fIJKOmhk
Marius Vincenzii Dennischter This is the summary of what I have found so far... and I also list the words that hasn't been translated. Unfortunately the dictionary page crashed again, so I unable to look further :S
and I'm too tired & sleepy anyway to wait for the dictionary to be re-downloaded.
Sorry...
Bis Bald, Lycka till!
achʋffa = unity
illa = only
yo̲ = the
Sʋshki & Aki are names
yʋt = who
wihʋt = move/ migrate
Himmako = subsequently
aiasha = to remains/ inhabitance
mʋt
achaka ma̲
imaboha
yʋmmako̲
si-aiʋlhpoa
and I'm too tired & sleepy anyway to wait for the dictionary to be re-downloaded.
Sorry...
Bis Bald, Lycka till!
achʋffa = unity
illa = only
yo̲ = the
Sʋshki & Aki are names
yʋt = who
wihʋt = move/ migrate
Himmako = subsequently
aiasha = to remains/ inhabitance
mʋt
achaka ma̲
imaboha
yʋmmako̲
si-aiʋlhpoa
Brad Wilson After reviewing the original, please note that the first 2 sentences are actually 1 sentence with a comma (which makes much more sense). Chukka itabana, aboha achʋffa illa yo̲, Sʋshki micha A̲ki yʋt wihʋt chukkoa tok.
Brad Wilson Vincensiu's glosses:
achʋffa = unity -OK
illa = only -OK
yo̲ = the -NO
Sʋshki & Aki are names -sort of
yʋt = who -Not really
wihʋt = move/ migrate -OK
Himmako = subsequently -OK
aiasha = to remains/ inhabitance -look at word combos
achʋffa = unity -OK
illa = only -OK
yo̲ = the -NO
Sʋshki & Aki are names -sort of
yʋt = who -Not really
wihʋt = move/ migrate -OK
Himmako = subsequently -OK
aiasha = to remains/ inhabitance -look at word combos
Sarah Karoline I had a Saint-Birgitta vision, and came up with the following. I can't find all the words, and I've been a bit creative...
Our house
Loghouse does as a single room.
Sʋshki and A̲ki who had moved in.
Subsequently, kitchen and bedroom were joined together.
So my grandmother had been moved in with us.
Two rooms that joined [ma̲], loghouse room where grandmother {temple} makes [tok]
Three log rooms [a̲sha yʋmmako̲ si-ahiolhpoa]
Our house
Loghouse does as a single room.
Sʋshki and A̲ki who had moved in.
Subsequently, kitchen and bedroom were joined together.
So my grandmother had been moved in with us.
Two rooms that joined [ma̲], loghouse room where grandmother {temple} makes [tok]
Three log rooms [a̲sha yʋmmako̲ si-ahiolhpoa]
Brad Wilson I think Birgitta was good to you. All the concepts are there. "temple" is very wrong. Sʋshki and A̲ki are "names", but they can be rendered into common words - they both start with possessive syllables.
Marius Vincenzii Dennischter It has been days, and I still cannot find si-ahiolhpoa anywhere,
any hints for us??
any hints for us??
Brad Wilson si- is a pronomial-passive prefix. ai- is a locative marker. The root is ʋlhpoa. The meaning is (I think) very idiomatic and probably will be difficult to get directly from the dictionary (but it is in there). The author translates it one way, but the dictionary translation works too (although a different meaning).
Brad Wilson Also remember that ʋ is also spelled ạ and is indexed separately in the dictionary (although it can be a mutated form of a). note: phonetically, ʋ is a schwa.
Brad Wilson Vincensiu ... you got that difficult gloss. The author translates it as "born", but "raised" matches all the dictionaries.
Sarah Karoline Stjälcuring from Vincensiu:
Our house
The loghouse does as a single room.
Mother and father (who) had moved in.
Subsequently, the kitchen and bedroom were joined together.
So my grandmother had moved in with us.
Two rooms that joined [ma̲], loghouse room where grandmother {temple} makes [tok]
Three log rooms [a̲sha yʋmmako̲] where I had been born.
--
I still can't find the bracketed words...
ma: together?
Our house
The loghouse does as a single room.
Mother and father (who) had moved in.
Subsequently, the kitchen and bedroom were joined together.
So my grandmother had moved in with us.
Two rooms that joined [ma̲], loghouse room where grandmother {temple} makes [tok]
Three log rooms [a̲sha yʋmmako̲] where I had been born.
--
I still can't find the bracketed words...
ma: together?
Brad Wilson The first 2 sentences are actually one (I misread a comma as a full stop). So re-gloss lines 1&2 together as a single sentence. {mother and father} is correct, but there are prefixes on both which need to be glossed (Choctaw kin words rarely appear without prefixes). {joined together} is almost right. {my grandmother} actually does *not* have the prefix (so it's more like a name than just a noun). After you properly gloss the "join together" sentence, then [ma̲] should make sense (the m- on the particle is a post-positive/successive prefix). I'm not sure where the {temple} gloss is coming from ... is that from imaboha ? (try to break this down to a prefix+noun, then it will be clear)
Marius Vincenzii Dennischter Oh my..... This has been dragging us for a while....
where are other players.... don't hide!
where are other players.... don't hide!
Marius Vincenzii Dennischter Our house
The loghouse does as a single room.
Mother and father (who) had moved in.
Subsequently, the kitchen and bedroom were joined together.
So my grandmother had moved in with us.
Two rooms that joined [ma̲], loghouse room where grandmother {temple} makes [tok]
Three log rooms [a̲sha yʋmmako̲] where I had been born.
The loghouse does as a single room.
Mother and father (who) had moved in.
Subsequently, the kitchen and bedroom were joined together.
So my grandmother had moved in with us.
Two rooms that joined [ma̲], loghouse room where grandmother {temple} makes [tok]
Three log rooms [a̲sha yʋmmako̲] where I had been born.
Marius Vincenzii Dennischter OUR HOUSE:
Mum & Dad had moved in to a loghouse with a single room.
Subsequently, the kitchen and bedroom were joined together.
So grandmother had moved in with us.
I can't think of any prefixes that can be attached to mother & father....
Mum & Dad had moved in to a loghouse with a single room.
Subsequently, the kitchen and bedroom were joined together.
So grandmother had moved in with us.
I can't think of any prefixes that can be attached to mother & father....
Brad Wilson The "root" words for father & mother are ki / shki, but they *never* appear without some sort of possessive prefix. The is the general rule for kin words.
Wrik Chatterjee Our House:
My mom and my dad moved into a loghouse with a single room. Later the kitchen and bedroom were joined together. Hence, my grandmother had to move in with us.
My mom and my dad moved into a loghouse with a single room. Later the kitchen and bedroom were joined together. Hence, my grandmother had to move in with us.
Brad Wilson good ... note that the house has a single room, so how could the kitchen and bedroom be joined together. It's a different action here.
Brad Wilson haha, I'd like to see a log studio apartment What would a growing family do to a one-room house?
What would a growing family do to a one-room house?Brad Wilson We already know that Granny moved in with them, and the author was born in the house, so one room was getting a little crowded.
Wrik Chatterjee Our House:
My mom and my dad moved into a loghouse with a single room. Later the kitchen and bedroom were rebuilt. Hence, my grandmother had to move in with us too.
My mom and my dad moved into a loghouse with a single room. Later the kitchen and bedroom were rebuilt. Hence, my grandmother had to move in with us too.
Brad Wilson well, not "rebuilt" ... and granny didn't "have" to move in (btw, there's no poss. prefix on Pokni, so it's probably just a pet name for her, like Grandma, or Granny)
Wrik Chatterjee My mom and my dad moved into a one-room loghouse. Later the kitchen and bedroom were put back together. Afterwards, Grandma moved in with us too.
Marius Vincenzii Dennischter OUR HOUSE:
My mum and my dad moved into a loghouse with a single room. Later, the kitchen and bedroom were constructed. Hence, Nanna moved in with us too.
My mum and my dad moved into a loghouse with a single room. Later, the kitchen and bedroom were constructed. Hence, Nanna moved in with us too.
Brad Wilson Vincensiu, you have the right idea ... the kitchen & bedroom were "added" ... so "join together" was along the right lines, but just not quite right.
Wrik Chatterjee Our House:
My mom and my dad moved into a loghouse with a single room. Later, A kitchen and bedroom were built. So Grandma moved in with us too.
My mom and my dad moved into a loghouse with a single room. Later, A kitchen and bedroom were built. So Grandma moved in with us too.
Brad Wilson The particles-pronouns (as they're called) make all the difference - and I'll admit that I don't completely understand them.
Wrik Chatterjee Is the point that the two rooms are being joined to the house itself, if not necessarily each other?
Brad Wilson Here's how that sentense breaks down ... Himmakoⁿ (later), ahoponi aboha (kitchen) micha (and) anusit (bed) aiasha {you still haven't glossed this word} aboha (room) yoⁿ (distinctive oblique particle) achakʋli (add) yohmi (thus) tok (past tense). [I switched to ⁿ to mark the nasal, since fb do underlines well]
Brad Wilson woohoo, we're picking up speed here ... I think people are getting tired of the Choctaw challenge and want to move on to something new
Brad Wilson nope ... rooms are generally /function/ aboha ... ahoponi (cook) aboha = kitchen ... anusit (sleep) aboha = bedroom ... here we have anusit aiasha aboha ... so it's more than just a bedroom
Wrik Chatterjee Our House:
My mom and my dad moved into a loghouse with a single room. Later, the kitchen, bedroom, and living room were attached. So Grandma moved in with us too.
My mom and my dad moved into a loghouse with a single room. Later, the kitchen, bedroom, and living room were attached. So Grandma moved in with us too.
Brad Wilson Here's the remaining 2 lines (many of these words you've glossed already):
Aboha tuklo mʋt achaka maⁿ, chukka itabana aboha mʋto Pokni imaboha toba tok.
Chukka aboha tuchina aⁿsha yʋmmakoⁿ si-ai-ʋlhpoa tok.
Aboha tuklo mʋt achaka maⁿ, chukka itabana aboha mʋto Pokni imaboha toba tok.
Chukka aboha tuchina aⁿsha yʋmmakoⁿ si-ai-ʋlhpoa tok.
Brad Wilson Wrik, there's no sense of "too" in this sentence. And as you'll see with the last 2 sentences, the "us" is not correct, although it's not specified in the Choctaw.
Brad Wilson And be careful ... how many rooms were added to this house? You'll see the total number in the last line, which will give you the answer.
Brad Wilson Sarah, there's no "too", and English "so" implies there was some motive. "yohmi" is just a statement of fact.
Marius Vincenzii Dennischter Ok, I'm going to bed now,
Wrik & Sarah I have got faith on both of you, so good luck and hopefully when I wake up we'll have a new round in other languages
Wrik & Sarah I have got faith on both of you, so good luck and hopefully when I wake up we'll have a new round in other languages
Brad Wilson Sarah, that is certainly the idea, the word "log" is not present. and there is no sense of "with" in this. The phrase "chukka aboha tuchina" should be a clue.
Sarah Karoline Success, success!!!!!
And the line above with a little guesswork inspired by St Birgitta...
Two rooms *were added...., the loghouse room *was given to* grandmother.
And the line above with a little guesswork inspired by St Birgitta...
Two rooms *were added...., the loghouse room *was given to* grandmother.
Sarah Karoline Oh no I've had another go. Now I shall go to sleep! Perhaps it'll be finished overnight....
Aboha tuklo mʋt achaka ma̲, chukka itabana aboha mʋto Pokni imaboha toba tok.
Two rooms [mʋt] attached [ma[, loghouse room [mʋto] grandmother [imaboha - transferred] made was.
---
Two rooms were [mʋt] attached, the loghouse room was *made my grandmother's.
*transferred to my grandmother
I've had another go. Now I shall go to sleep! Perhaps it'll be finished overnight.... Aboha tuklo mʋt achaka ma̲, chukka itabana aboha mʋto Pokni imaboha toba tok.
Two rooms [mʋt] attached [ma[, loghouse room [mʋto] grandmother [imaboha - transferred] made was.
---
Two rooms were [mʋt] attached, the loghouse room was *made my grandmother's.
*transferred to my grandmother
Sarah Karoline I think this is a summary of what we have so far:
My mom and my dad moved into a loghouse with a single room.
Later, a kitchen and bedroom were built/added, so Grandma moved in with them.
-----/this is the line I've been working on/------
I was born in this three-roomed house.
My mom and my dad moved into a loghouse with a single room.
Later, a kitchen and bedroom were built/added, so Grandma moved in with them.
-----/this is the line I've been working on/------
I was born in this three-roomed house.
Brad Wilson You're almost there. Earlier I think I said what the m- prefix means on particles (ma̲, mʋt).
Brad Wilson Actually, now that I look back, I did *not* explain the m- prefix. Look on pages 325-326 for an explanation of the "a/ʋ" particle and what the prefixes & suffixes mean.
Sarah Karoline My mom and my dad moved into a loghouse with a single room.
Later, a kitchen and bedroom were built/added, so Grandma moved in with them.
Two rooms were [mʋt=ALSO] attached, the loghouse room was *made my grandmother's.
I was born in this three-roomed house.
Later, a kitchen and bedroom were built/added, so Grandma moved in with them.
Two rooms were [mʋt=ALSO] attached, the loghouse room was *made my grandmother's.
I was born in this three-roomed house.
Brad Wilson Aboha (room) tuklo (two) [mʋt] achaka (add) [maⁿ] (I've switched to ⁿ) ... the particles are giving you trouble. The vowels in both (ʋ/a) indicate that these are "definite", the -t indicates "nominative case", the m- indicates "post-positive/successive). Does that help?
Brad Wilson chukka (house) itabana (log) aboha (room) [mʋto] Pokni (Grandma) [imaboha] [toba] tok (past) ... mʋto (see above) has an additional suffix -o which indicates "locative". Imaboha looks like aboha (room) ... what's the prefix for? You gloss toba tok as "was made" which is so close I'm inclined to say OK on that.
Brad Wilson I must go off-line for a couple of hours, but I'll be back to check the progress, insha'allah.
Marius Vincenzii Dennischter I'm at work atm, so limited internet access.
Summary of what we have gotten so far (for the penultimate line);
Room two MVT add MĀ, house log room MVTO Granny IMABOHA was made past.
Random guess;
Two rooms (were) added, the past/previous loghouse room was made for Granny.
Q: where should I slip the remaing words to??
Summary of what we have gotten so far (for the penultimate line);
Room two MVT add MĀ, house log room MVTO Granny IMABOHA was made past.
Random guess;
Two rooms (were) added, the past/previous loghouse room was made for Granny.
Q: where should I slip the remaing words to??
Brad Wilson The particles apply to the preceding noun or verb, so MVT & MÄ applies to the adding of 2 rooms, and IMABOHA is governed by Granny - so what is the prefix on IMABOHA?
Marius Vincenzii Dennischter I found that the prefix im- related to 3rd person possesive. so it'd be:
Room two mʋt add ma̲, house log room mʋto Granny's room was made.
it's getting confusing....
Room two mʋt add ma̲, house log room mʋto Granny's room was made.
it's getting confusing....
Brad Wilson Yes, im- is possessive, so Granny's room is correct. Let's see how I can describe mʋt without giving it away ... m- means successive, something happened after something else; ʋ is definite, so we're talking about something specific; -t means it's nominative. As for ma̲, it's the same thing for the verb. Numbers come after noun, so "aboha tuklo" is "two rooms"
Brad Wilson I'll be off-line for about 6 hours while travelling. Check back in tonight - perhaps I can crown a winner ...
Marius Vincenzii Dennischter Actually, let me summarise what we have got so far:
Our house
My mum and my dad moved into a loghouse with a single room.
Later, a kitchen and bedroom were built/added, so Grandma moved in with them.
Two room (mʋt) add ma̲, house log room (mʋto) Granny's room was made.
I was born in this three-roomed house.
Our house
My mum and my dad moved into a loghouse with a single room.
Later, a kitchen and bedroom were built/added, so Grandma moved in with them.
Two room (mʋt) add ma̲, house log room (mʋto) Granny's room was made.
I was born in this three-roomed house.
Marius Vincenzii Dennischter after two room was added, the log house room was made into Granny's room?
Marius Vincenzii Dennischter wow, that was just a random guess, I was just trying to mend the oddity of the structure of the sentence :O
Wrik Chatterjee Our House:
My mom and my dad moved into a loghouse with just one room. Later a kitchen and bedroom were built, so Grandma moved in with them. After these two rooms were added, the loghouse room was made into Grandma's room. I was born in this three-roomed house.
My mom and my dad moved into a loghouse with just one room. Later a kitchen and bedroom were built, so Grandma moved in with them. After these two rooms were added, the loghouse room was made into Grandma's room. I was born in this three-roomed house.
Brad Wilson There are a couple of minor items, but I'll give it t you ... this has been going on long enough.
Wrik Chatterjee Indeed. So I'm either doing my round in a Northeast Caucasian language, or a language that's much, much more widely spoken than any Northeast Caucasian language; it's so commonly spoken that I've come up with a way to make it a little trickier. Any preferences?
Brad Wilson Our House by Eveline Battiest Steele
My mother and father moved into a one-room log house.
Later, another bedroom/living room combination and kitchen were added.
Then Grandma moved in with them.
After the two rooms were added, the log room became Grandma’s room.
I was born in this three-room house.
My mother and father moved into a one-room log house.
Later, another bedroom/living room combination and kitchen were added.
Then Grandma moved in with them.
After the two rooms were added, the log room became Grandma’s room.
I was born in this three-room house.
Marius Vincenzii Dennischter Wrik my suggestion is try to lower the rating down to attract more players. As you can see, the Choctaw round was played by only few people. I just checked the sps website. This Choctaw rounds is the second most difficult round rating 5829!!
Wrik Chatterjee Okay, so I'll pick the much more widely spoken one. I was thinking of adopting the style of Andy Ayres's Romani round but with an easier language.
Brad Wilson In case anyone's interested in following up with a study of Choctaw, I'm currently formatting the grammar into a more easily readable pdf which I'll post here when I'm done.
Marius Vincenzii Dennischter Wrik Have you come up with an idea yet?
Not that I can play atm, but just curious about the next round.
Not that I can play atm, but just curious about the next round.
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